Odd spot with middle 2 pair (10NL)

[nawhead]

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

SB ($11.85)
BB ($10)
UTG ($8.30)
MP ($14.40)
Hero (Button) ($13.40)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 10, J
1 fold, MP raises to $0.35, Hero calls $0.35, 2 folds

Flop: ($0.85) 6, J, 10 (2 players)
MP bets $0.50, Hero calls $0.50

Turn: ($1.85) K (3 players)
MP checks, Hero bets $1.50, MP raises to $3.50, Hero ???

Sat at table only short time, no history. Just playing my hand. Options? Considerations?

I don' think I can just call here. I have about 9 behind and the pot will be be about 9 if I call. I'm really only thinking push or fold. I don't know if I can call a pot size bet on river if river bricks since I'm putting him on KJ or even maybe AQ. And at same time, I don't know if I can get value on river if river bricks if he's looking for info with AK but is going to call a turn push.

I slowplayed flop, got action on turn... so time to get paid is my thinking. I don't really know how to put villain on a hand tho is my problem. Or what ranges. I'm pretty sure he's got like the nutz here a good deal with this kind of fishy check-raise. But then people do fishy check-raises with AA and AK here as well, so I'm torn.

[Viscus]

I fold pre. I don't mind a call sometimes, especially OTB, but you get into awkward spots like this so often against a raise that I just dump it more often than not. Against an unknown with no stats, no reads and no idea of his play, I find a fold 100% of the time.

On the flop, I raise. We're assuming QQ+ and AQ+ make up a large portion of his range from the play so far (just generalising here, we can't really put him on much else if this is the first hand we've played with him), so I raise for value against these hands as I think they're all peeling/3betting/shoving. And effective stacks are relatively deep, so I much prefer a raise here because I don't think he's folding anything, except 77 through 99, which I don't think we're getting any more value out of anyway.

The fishy check raise is definitely horrible and is very awkward, but I'm not quite sure how to interpret it. The board is very wet, so I don't know if AQ/KJ/KT type hands check for fear of you checking behind and them facing a possible awkward river OOP. It sucks for us if he puts us on KJ/KT/JT type hands because he wants us to put more money in with 2p here, although I don't think it's a stretch for him to think KQ is very likely our hand here, in which case his likely holding is AA. Given the weird turn line, AA/KK is very likely imo.

Very awkward, but I don't really mind either a fold or a call. Folding sucks, but if you don't think he does it with anything we beat, dump it. And I don't mind a call because we have position and are dictating the river play. We can fold to any significant bet, we can check behind, we can value bet decent rivers, we could even fold out better hands on scary rivers. Really I don't know what my line would be, just a horrible spot to be in . :P

I'm a micro stakes donk myself though, so take the above with a grain of salt. Just my thoughts.

[crypto007]

I would shove AI. You are sitting little better than 3 to 1 favorite.

Board: Jh Ts 6c
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 76.612% 76.55% 00.06% 72752 60.00 { JdTd }
Hand 1: 23.388% 23.32% 00.06% 22168 60.00 { QQ+, ATs+, KTs+, QTs+, AJo+, KJo+, QJo }

The only two hands that can crush you are JJ and TT but the since you have one and one is out on the board, the likely hood that he has them is very slim. I do not think he would raise PF with Q9 either. But I have been wrong before

Board: Ts Jh 6c
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 04.444% 04.44% 00.00% 88 0.00 { JdTd }
Hand 1: 95.556% 95.56% 00.00% 1892 0.00 { JJ-TT }

[nawhead]

Originally Posted by crypto007

I would shove AI. You are sitting little better than 3 to 1 favorite.

Board: Jh Ts 6c

We're at the turn now.

But I really don't like some of those hands you have in his range, especially AJ, AT, QTs, QJ, QQ. I think either villain has the best hand or thinks he has the best hand.

Originally Posted by Viscus

I fold pre.

I'm experimenting with playing more in position with suited connecter type hands to round out my game. I thought JTs fits this purpose fine. Let's just call it a learning leak.

Originally Posted by Viscus

On the flop, I raise.

I tend to slowplay too much sometimes, but the board's so dry and there's just a straight or a gutshot broadway draw, so I thought it was ok. I want him to think I have a ten or a Jx type hand. I think AA,KK, maybe AJ probably felts this flop, but then again it's such a dry flop that it's easy to put me on a set or 2 pair if I start raising. I think I'm sitting pretty versus AK,AQ,QQ-AA tho, so I don't want to reveal my hand just yet and I think there's a lot of turn cards very good for me that improves villain's weaker holdings that couldn't call a raise on the flop.... thus the slowplay.

Originally Posted by Viscus

Very awkward, but I don't really mind either a fold or a call. Folding sucks, but if you don't think he does it with anything we beat, dump it. And I don't mind a call because we have position and are dictating the river play. We can fold to any significant bet, we can check behind, we can value bet decent rivers, we could even fold out better hands on scary rivers. Really I don't know what my line would be, just a horrible spot to be in . :P
I'm a micro stakes donk myself though, so take the above with a grain of salt. Just my thoughts.

I'm hitting myself over the head because this is exactly the type of thinking I want to ingrain in me with calling JTs on the button. I don't know why I was so hard-headed on pushing or folding the turn. I basically have 100bb's behind me after a turn call. I think calling and reevaluating river is good. I'm not looking to bluff a scary card, but maybe it'll slow down the action and let me see a cheap showdown if I'm beat, and if it bricks, let me get some value from AA/AK without risking a whole bunch of chips.

Thanks!

[TheDeKay]

I actually don't mind a call on the turn here, cause a shove looks soooo strong here and we rep about what we have. It's very unlikely, that we have the straight, so if we shove it's 2pair or a set, since we won't bluff without history.

I would put him on AQ or KK. The crai on the turn looks like a "omgomgomg I turned the nuts! what should I doooo? I check and see what he does!!!!"-play, but I call anyways on the turn, cause I do not want to give him too much fold equity /w a weird play. I might fold a bricked river, if he shoves, cause I believe, that ppl on that limit do not crai bluff the turn and shoot a third barrel-all in on the river that often. (But if ppl think of TPTK as the nuts, I call of course ^^ Didn't play 10NL for a while, so I don't know).

[given1982]

Raise the flop.

[ThatDeviant]

Originally Posted by given1982

Raise the flop.

Ding.

[Aji89]

Pre flop call is perfectly fine. I think you should definitely raise the flop here. As played I I'd call the turn raise and fold to a river bet/shove since I don't think he'd bet worse hands than yours on the river since you obviously like your hand.

[Qgel]

Preflop call is standart as long as you don't overplay 1 pair type hands.

Flop you should RAISE FOR VALUE ! Hope I stressed that enough He's never folding overpairs/AJ unless he's a huge nit. And he will still atleast call your raise w/ KJ/QJ. You need to realize that the ideal situation for you would be to get it all in right there on the flop.

Turn his line looks very strong and sadly with your 2pair, which was a monster on the flop, you now only beat a bluff. Either fold or call his fishy value minraise and fold to his (expected) big river bet.

[nawhead]

Thanks a lot for all the good responses! I can see now where my thought process really broke down. I did call with the JTs because in my mind I'm either A. winning a very small pot with 1 pair or B. winning a big pot with 2 pair or better. I had blinders on to the situation developing and basically played the hand like the immortal nuts.

Results:

I time down because I want him to think that I'm pondering a call, but all I'm really thinkin about is Vegas and the fuckin' Mirage.

"Let's see, uh...I got the 2, plus, uh, another 9 to um raise you um uh...Yeah, I'm gonna go all in, cuz I don't think you have it."

Villain calls and turns over KK.

"..."