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Old 01-06-2009, 09:43 PM
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Default $10nl 6max Video (sexy LAG imo)

I recorded this session last week and for some reason the audio kept getting further and further ahead of the video as it progressed. By the end it was off by nearly 30 seconds which really made it useless. So I just narrated over the old audio and went into a little more detail -- this is actually only the first 30 minutes of the original session since I pause a lot to go into greater detail about certain hands, and to explain how I like to play micro-stakes 6max.

I run very well in the video and end up winning quite a bit (8 buy-ins in the hour), obviously that's not something that happens often, but there were a lot of interesting hands (imo) so I decided to keep the video.

Video info:
4-tables - $10nl - 6max - AP (Cereus) - 200bb buy-in - ~55 minutes - ~66mb - WMV format

Download from megaupload


Please watch and post your thoughts/comments/criticisms after. This is the first time I've made a video that wasn't meant for my own benefit so please be kind.
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Old 01-06-2009, 09:45 PM
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DLing now, hopefully I'll get to watching it tonight; will leave comments. Idk if I'll pause the video and go through hand by hand or just make general comments.
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Old 01-06-2009, 09:54 PM
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Just kidding, megaupload loves to interrupt my downloads and then make me wait until I can try again! wheeeee
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Old 01-07-2009, 05:24 AM
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First of all, I'm only halfway through, but nice video thusfar, you make your thoughts very clear and explain your plays. Never played on AP/UB, the software looks pretty terrible (although I mostly play on cake, so I guess I can't complain). For people who watch this, I want to reemphasize that playing this style generally requires a lot of postflop skill. As you said, you'll be getting into tons of marginal spots, and someone who's not comfortable playing medium str-weak hands postflop will get into trouble more often than not. However, with the right postflop skill, this style can be very successful in the right games. Also, as you alluded to, playing this style will inevitably lead to getting better postflop since you're forced into so many postflop situations. Here are a few thoughts:

Around 9:00 in, you have KQs in the bb. Button has raised 4x and sb has minraised. You say that you think your options are 4betting or calling, but I'm folding here all day. Button is short and has made a larger-than-normal raise for him. SB minraised, which in my experience usually indicates a big hand (as you say, his range is pretty tight). If you cold call and button shoves, you say you're okay with calling but I don't think your equity is very good against his 4betting range (maybe he's a spewwy donk tho, idk). The combination of possibly facing a 4b with a hand I don't love and the fact that sb minraised, indicating a big hand, makes me just want to let this go. Fwiw, I'm writing this before the hand plays out, so we'll see what happens.

18:00ish in, KQ on the button, definitely fold on the turn as you said. I do think it's a mistake to be calling a 2nd barrel from a passive opponent w/ TPGK & a gutter, esp when his bet commits him to the pot. You're really not ahead of anything in a passive player's range that he CR's the flop & pots the turn with.

Gonna head to bed now and watch the other half tomorrow. Thanks for making this.
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Old 01-07-2009, 04:48 PM
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The second KQ hand I definitely prefer a turn fold in retrospect... while playing I guess I got caught up in the "I has top pair, I has straight draw" and didn't pay attention to spr and stuff like that.

The KQs hand I still like my play. The UTG opener was varying his raise sizes, but we didn't know what they meant at that point. I was still putting him on a fairly wide range -- and I know that shorties are capable of 4bet shoving any pair, most Axs hands, most suited broadway hands, and random trash that they didn't feel like folding. I would be getting like 3-1 on a call, so it's a pretty clear call should he shove and the sb just calls.

As for the sb who min 3bet. Yes, his range is way ahead of me, but we're ~200bb deep, and I have a hand that I feel very confident playing post flop. Given the preflop action I'm not going to put in a lot of money with just TPGK -- but when I do hit a big hand or a big draw we are deep enough that I can get a lot of value out of him.

Had he made a reasonably sized 3bet I'd be folding preflop, but since he just min 3bets I'm never folding a suited broadway hand in that spot.

Thanks for watching!
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Old 01-07-2009, 05:18 PM
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Enjoyed the vid NOFX

About 15-16mins in you 3bet a loose aggressive spewwy button opener with A3s and flop 2 pair.

Couple hypothetical questions regarding this hand

1)If you completely airball this flop, what type of board textures are you looking to cbet if any against a player like this that is pretty sticky.

2) Same board texture and action in the hand except the 3c is the 2c, so you have one pair, is there anyway you continue here? Also what's your plan on the turn if he flats the flop and the turn is a brick.
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Old 01-07-2009, 08:19 PM
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It's important to keep in mind that while I knew the villain was LAGy preflop, I didn't really know whether he was spewy/bad post flop. Mostly when I 3bet a suited ace in that spot it's to take it down preflop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by richyl View Post
1)If you completely airball this flop, what type of board textures are you looking to cbet if any against a player like this that is pretty sticky.
If I completely whiff the flop I'd be c-betting only on real dry flops... stuff like K83r, Qc2c6x, etc... On wet boards that I've completely missed I will usually c/f, although I will usually bet at monotone boards and boards that are all high cards (obviously turning my hand into a bluff).

Quote:
2) Same board texture and action in the hand except the 3c is the 2c, so you have one pair, is there anyway you continue here? Also what's your plan on the turn if he flats the flop and the turn is a brick.
If the flop had come A2J I would c/c the flop and re-evaluate on the turn. I see no reason to c-bet a weak top pair OOP in a 3bet pot especially on such a dry board. As for the second part, I'm not sure what I'd do since I wouldn't play the hand that way unless I planned to fire a turn brick for value.
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Old 01-08-2009, 12:42 AM
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OK, so you proved that it's possible to profit playing LAG at 10NL. You proved you're a better player than most random 10NL donks. I'll even disregard sample size variance and just give you the benefit of the doubt since you play higher stakes. But how does this help a beginner?

You started this whole line of thinking by advising a guy who's breakeven at 10NL playing a 18/14 game to loosen up. Let's just assume for argument sake (please don't take personal offense OP, just hypothetically speaking here) that there's no variance and that OP is just a bad, spewy player. That he actually doesn't know how to play profitable poker, TAG or otherwise.

Your advice was to loosen up. That he should learn LAG to profit. That he should learn LAG to get better.

But this doesn't make sense.

LAG requires a lot of feel and quick adjustments. One has to rely on a lot of instincts and gut feelings from tens of thousands of hands he has played in the past. Instincts acquired from situations when he were playing TAG.

Beginners don't have these instincts to fall back on. They don't play TAG. They just play randomly. They raise a range they saw in a video (Tight) and bet (AGgressive) but don't know when to stop betting. They don't know how to change gears. They don't have feel.

And without that long period of playing TAG and putting all those situations into the memory banks and getting that feel, they have no chance to profitably play LAG.

To advise some guy who doesn't know how to play TAG to learn LAG is disregarding the natural progression of learning this game. It can't be done. It's like telling some kid that keeps losing go-kart races to get into a F1 race car on the same track to get better.

And this video, while it may stroke your own ego, is going to hurt newer players and cause pointless frustration rather than help them.

Last edited by nawhead; 01-08-2009 at 12:55 AM.
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Old 01-08-2009, 12:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nawhead View Post
And this video, while it may stroke your own ego, is going to cost newer players many, many buyins in pointless frustration.
Saying he made this video to stroke his own ego seems a bit absurd. I understand why you could say that, but NOFX made this video to help other players out; if it proved a point that's been argued about, and maybe "made himself feel all warm inside" as a side effect, then okay.

If most of the concepts are properly applied in the correct context by a player with the right skillset, the style can be successful, as OP showed. That's why OP stated in the beginning of his vid that the style requires a lot of postflop skills since you'll be getting into so many marginal situations. It's also why I tried to give similar warnings in my review of the video. If people misapply the lessons being taught or use this style before they're ready, that's at their own peril. They have been properly warned and if they chose to ignore them, that's not the teacher's fault.
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Old 01-08-2009, 01:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nawhead View Post

And this video, while it may stroke your own ego, is going to hurt newer players and cause pointless frustration rather than help them.

lol you do realise that by spending his time doing a 10nl video he's actually costing himself money since he'd normally play 50nl + I presume and I'm pretty sure he'd choose money over stroking his ego via an internet forum.
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