NL50 Aces vs Donk and Aggro

[LongDonkSilver]

Hi,

first, sorry I can´t post the original converted hand, only a copy paste version of it.
What do you think of this line?
how can I extract maximum value of this hand?
UTG is a fish, with a Vpip over 50
but the BTN is very interesting as I had some good reads on him. He plays 25/23/8 with a very high 3bet factor when he is in position. He plays very very aggressive when he feels only a little weakness at his opponents either pre and postflop. But if you show strength he very often folds his hand.
I only call the push of the donk with the hope the BTN comes over the top. A call I didn´t want to see here. What do you think of my line? it looks like TT,JJ,QQ or something like that or does it look very strong which was not my intention cause I wanted him to shove pre to isolate the fish.
which range do you give him here? because of my preflop call I give him good odds to call with SCs,... or do you think these Types of hands are not in his range?
I checked the flop, because I wanted to give him the possibilty to use the A as a scare card. Now I have realized that it makes no sense because there is no side pot. You think a very aggressive player bets here the flop to come to showdown with the fish with hands like JJ,QQ,AK,AQ or a flush draw?

$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at weaktight | fold when you know you're beat
Stacks:
UTG ($24.63)
UTG+1 ($49.45)
Hero (CO) ($184.49)
BTN ($133.41)
SB ($11.78)
BB ($56.99)
Pre-flop: ($0.75, 6 players) Hero is CO As Ah
UTG calls $0.50, 1 fold, Hero raises to $2.50, BTN raises to $7.75, 2 folds, UTG raises to $24.63, Hero calls $22.13, BTN calls $16.88
Flop: Ac 6h 5c ($74.64, 3 players)
Hero checks, BTN checks
Turn: 7c ($74.64, 3 players)
Hero bets $30.50, BTN folds
River: Ks ($105.14, 2 players)
Final Pot: $105.14
UTG shows: Kd 8d
Hero wins $102.14 ( won +$47.01 )
BTN lost -$24.63
UTG lost -$24.63

[lowkey]

But if you show strength he very often folds his hand.

He's playing smart basically. Whatever he had (highish pp 88-1010 imo) bricked the flop, and given the PF action he figured he was up against at least one player with an ace or an overpair and got out when you bet.

Not much you could do to keep him in the pot and still make money on him

[no eff eks]

Looks fine to me, nh.

[Qgel]

I actually prefer a small 5bet pre to either get BTN out of the pot or make him put more money preflop with a weaker hand. Because now you're giving him great odds to call for set value with pairs or for flush/straight/trips/2pair value with his SCs. You have to be very willing to fold unimproved AA postflop if you get a lot of action from the BTN since being over 250BBs deep AA have a lot of reverse implied odds.

As played: you HAVE to bet the flop. Yes, most of the time he won't have a hand good enough to call/raise you but he should also NEVER bluff in this spot if you check with UTG being all in. Trying to induce a bluff from someone who will never bluff is kind of silly, isn't it ? So instead you should bet to protect your hand from possible draws and of course for value in case he has AK/AQ or a set/2pair.

[no eff eks]

Originally Posted by Qgel

You have to be very willing to fold unimproved AA postflop if you get a lot of action from the BTN since being over 250BBs deep AA have a lot of reverse implied odds.

If you're not able to fold AA unimproved post-flop when this deep you should probably not be playing that deep. That said, I don't think you should ever really be folding AA post-flop in this specific hand given the SPR.

As played: you HAVE to bet the flop.

Um, no you don't. You've got the deck crushed and he's waaaay behind with everything (including draws). It's not going to be hard to get stacks in by the river even when checking the flop.

[LongDonkSilver]

Originally Posted by Qgel

I actually prefer a small 5bet pre to either get BTN out of the pot or make him put more money preflop with a weaker hand. Because now you're giving him great odds to call for set value with pairs or for flush/straight/trips/2pair value with his SCs. You have to be very willing to fold unimproved AA postflop if you get a lot of action from the BTN since being over 250BBs deep AA have a lot of reverse implied odds.

As played: you HAVE to bet the flop. Yes, most of the time he won't have a hand good enough to call/raise you but he should also NEVER bluff in this spot if you check with UTG being all in. Trying to induce a bluff from someone who will never bluff is kind of silly, isn't it ? So instead you should bet to protect your hand from possible draws and of course for value in case he has AK/AQ or a set/2pair.

a 5bet is the usual play here, I know, but in this spot I wanted to play my opponent because of his big aggression.
I wanted him to make the 5bet with hands like AK,QQ,JJ cause he must have realized too that UTG is a fish he wants to isolate with a strong hand + I didn´t show real strength.
In thought of min-raising here to build a side pot. Yeah, it was a little risky because of the good odds I gave him.

Flop:
it doesn´t have to be a bluff betting the flop here. He can have a lot of hands with showdown value against the fish.
How would you think he would have played the following hands after my check regarding his aggression?
TT-QQ KK he probably would have 5betted
AQ, AK
a set, two pair
flush draw, straight draw

[Qgel]

Originally Posted by no eff eks

Um, no you don't. You've got the deck crushed and he's waaaay behind with everything (including draws). It's not going to be hard to get stacks in by the river even when checking the flop.

OK, tell me what exactly checking the flop accomplishes ? He's aggresive, but not a maniac by any means as far as stats are concerned, so he won't bluff the flop since there's a sidepot with UTG. Because of that same reason he should not even semi bluff with his draws which could be disastrous for us if we let him get there for free.
In fact, the only good thing that could come out of us checking the flop is if he checks behind with, say, TT and miraculously spikes a T on the turn.

[Qgel]

Originally Posted by LongDonkSilver

Flop:
it doesn´t have to be a bluff betting the flop here. He can have a lot of hands with showdown value against the fish.
How would you think he would have played the following hands after my check regarding his aggression?
TT-QQ KK he probably would have 5betted
AQ, AK
a set, two pair
flush draw, straight draw

The thing is, he will check behind many marginal hands with showdown value and with hands that he will bet (like AQ/AK) he will also call at least one street, so we're not losing any value if we just bet.

5bet with TT-QQ ? No, MAYBE with QQ but even with that he might just flat preflop because of how deep you are. KK+ sure, he's 5betting. All these hands he will check behind on the flop if he's competent.

AQ/AK I already explained. Same goes for sets and 2 pairs. He will bet if you check, but he would call or raise if you had bet anyway. Btw, what were you planning to do if he did bet? C/raise? Well, that line represents a lot of strength and depending on how good the villain is at hand reading he can easily get away from some good hands. By betting you're only representing TP, generally and are more likely to get called down lighter.

With draws he might bet, depending on how big is his draw. OESD + FD he will be very happy to bet and stack off but if he only has a gutshot, naked straight draw or something close to that, then he will not bet and in the case he does hit on the turn you'll end up getting stacked.

[LongDonkSilver]

ok, thank you, sounds logical

btw
I meant TT-QQ;
KK he probably...

[no eff eks]

Originally Posted by Qgel

OK, tell me what exactly checking the flop accomplishes ?

We completely disguise the strength of our hand. Remember, we are not the aggressor here as we just called PF. Our range includes mostly hands that have nothing but marginal showdown value on a board like this given our preflop play (77-JJ being the biggest part of our range, plus some hands like AK/AQ/KQ/etc).

Basically he's never going to be able to put us on aces, and by betting at all we are representing an extremely tight range (meaning our range is polarized)... when somebody has a very polarized range and their line doesn't make sense for a huge hand you should be calling down lighter than usual.