Question for Tikkur Re Trik29 Vid

[SonHouse]

This is my first post so I would first of all just like to say hello. I've watched a few of the videos and looked around the site the last couple of weeks and have been very impressed. So thank you for making this content free for all.

The question I wanted to ask was if a specific flop concept could be explained to me. It occurs in Vid 29 on table 1 at 26:00, and is the QQ v 88 hand on the 4c4h10c board where your read was spot on.

You say that its unlikely that he would donk bet the flop with a 10 as a better line would be to check call, so 88 seemed more likely. It also relates to something I 've been reading recently.
The author says ( re donk betting ), what you do not want to do is lead 99 on J77 unless the villian is bad as good players will see right through this.

Could you please explain this concept in more detail, as in what to do on the turn if you c/c with medium pairs and why you shouldn't lead a 10 as in the Vid? If you c/c the 10 do you c/f turn if there's overcards?

Thanks

[Colossos159]

Hi,
I watched the vid yesterday and I found it a very interesting one because you are actually losing in the beginning but you keep playing your game and finally it pays of (I think).
You asked for more ideas in videos and what to talk about:

- Whenever I watch a movie , I am always disappointed when there is no Pockertracker review of some interesting hands afterwards. During the game you sometimes are too busy with other hands and it is hard to keep your train of thought (which is completely understandable). So pls include this in your next vid.
- Maybe you can talk about how you first started playing poker. What limits did you start? How were things going first? Did you read books? Whats the most stupid thing you did when you were on tilt? I'd love to know how you played your first months of poker in the 10NL games or so. Did you ever busted your account? Stuff like that.
- Which sites do you recommend in view of fish and traffic (not rakeback ). Are there certain times in a day when more fish is playing?
- Do you ever play SitnGo's? Make a vid about you playing 2 SitnGo's? I know sitngo arent that interesting because of the fold-fold-fold-Allin-fold-fold-... nature but anyway. Do you ever play multi table tournaments? Do you play live?
- Whenever there is a hand going on in which you are not involved, maybe you should try and "guess" what the opponents are holding.
- A blog forum where anyone can post his progress. I just moved up to 50 NL since yesterday and it didnt went too good...... (I made the dumbest mistake in the 5th hand and lost a buy in, I'll post the hand in another forum section)
- Are you still considering poker as a game or do you "work" from 9 to 5? If you have a bad day at work (read: bad beat) does it influence your attitude? If I come home from work and play bad poker , I am getting sooooooo annoyed (like yesterday).

[given1982]

Around 22 minutes in, you call a 3bet OOP with 88, explaining that the UTG vs. UTG+1 dynamic made it more likely that villain's range was very tight, giving you proper odds for setmining. But then you c/c his half-pot cbet on a J23 flop and check it to him on the turn and river. Why did you call the cbet? Were you planning to steal on certain turn or river cards or hoping to see a free showdown after that?

You mentioned having concepts to talk about for videos, but the live hands not cooperating with you by bringing up those themes. What do you think about doing a video that doesn't involve live play? You could do a lecture style video where you pick out hand histories that exemplify the concept(s) that you want to talk about and run them through a replayer as you do commentary. I also still think that doing commentary over a member's video would be a good idea. But maybe I've just been watching too much deuces cracked lately.

[adam258]

For starters, LMFAO @ calling the guy a douchebag. That was priceless! Don't feel bad about it either Trikkur. The dude WAS a douchebag and it was nice to finally here a pro say what they are really thinking when that chit happens. I hope down the road he hears about Pokertrikz and watches the vid so he can see how we all think he is a douchebag.

Personally, I don't understand why there needs to be a set "theme" for a vid. I just want to see more of you playing sessions and talking about situations that come up. I don't think you need to go into a vid with a set theme unless maybe that helps you with making a vid, I dunno.

Anyways, topics that you could talk about other than the actual situations: bankroll management, ur life as a pro, decision to go pro, how u started out way back when at 5nl or 10nl, if you read/watched/used something that really transformed your game, your thoughts on different poker books and other resources available, ..... you could even go as far as talking about a movie or something that you have recently seen that you would recommend for horror flicks fans. Just some ideas. Definitely don't need to try to make a vid for each one or anything. Just trying to help ya brainstorm a little.

[Trikkur]

The question I wanted to ask was if a specific flop concept could be explained to me. It occurs in Vid 29 on table 1 at 26:00, and is the QQ v 88 hand on the 4c4h10c board where your read was spot on.

You say that its unlikely that he would donk bet the flop with a 10 as a better line would be to check call, so 88 seemed more likely. It also relates to something I 've been reading recently.
The author says ( re donk betting ), what you do not want to do is lead 99 on J77 unless the villian is bad as good players will see right through this.

Could you please explain this concept in more detail, as in what to do on the turn if you c/c with medium pairs and why you shouldn't lead a 10 as in the Vid? If you c/c the 10 do you c/f turn if there's overcards?

In his mind, he likes his 88 because there is only 1 overcard, so he wants to donk out to see where he is at, unfortunately for him, it's pretty obvious that's what he's doing. To me I don't think he does this with a T because thinking about it from his perspective, if he has like AT, he thinks I'm going to cbet and hes going to call because he's much more sure he's good.

You shouldn't lead the T, just because it doesn't make any sense. You don't want fold equity because your hand is probably good. If you c/c the flop with like 88, you have to just make a read on the turn and river depending on your opponent and the board texture.

Around 22 minutes in, you call a 3bet OOP with 88, explaining that the UTG vs. UTG+1 dynamic made it more likely that villain's range was very tight, giving you proper odds for setmining. But then you c/c his half-pot cbet on a J23 flop and check it to him on the turn and river. Why did you call the cbet? Were you planning to steal on certain turn or river cards or hoping to see a free showdown after that?

I decided to call once because there are still enough hands in his range that I can call. If he would bet the turn or river, I would of just c/f, no big deal. He's almost never bluffing with like AK and it's almost always TP or an overpair.


Everyone gave me some good ideas I'll talk about in some future videos. Thanks for the suggestions, I'll write these down on a notepad and look at them while making my next vid, so I remember to talk about them.

[Trikkur]

I went back and watched the 88 hand again, because it seems important to me to talk about this. So I'll walk through my though process of the entire hand.

Obviously a raise with 88 UTG is standard, then we get 3-bet from UTG+1 and it's folded around to us. I knew I was getting 13:1 at least and I say that, but in actuality I'm getting 15:1. I decide to call here because post flop becomes relatively easy to play, when our villains range is much tighter from these spots. It's probably JJ+, AK+ and maybe like AQs. This means on average I'll get paid off with my set a higher percentage of the time than if it was like button vs SB.

So now the flop comes J23r and I check. He only bets 1/2 pot and while his range is pretty tight, there are a lot of combinations of AK as compared to JJ,QQ,KK,AA. So I decide to peel 1. I don't really expect him to start bluffing this dry of a board on later streets so I think my call is pretty safe in this spot. If you want to fold, it's not really a big deal to do so. The turn comes a blank, but again, I'm ready to check/fold because I don't feel like he's going to fire 2 streets on this dry of a board with AQ/AK so I think his range would then way towards the high PPs. He checks behind and the river is another blank. Same thought process that I had on the turn applies to the river as well. I don't think he's going to bluff me too often so I'm happy to get to showdown if I can, but if he bets, I'll just fold my hand, which ends up happening.

[SonHouse]

Thanks for answering my question Trikkur.

I just noticed in the micro stakes forum you answered a post on donk betting with

"Most common times to donk lead are when you are going to bet/3bet their raise with a set or a big draw that has like 12+ outs. I have been doinking mid-pair type hands a little more, but I'm still experimenting with that, so I can't really give any advice on those times."

Would it be possible to highlight some of these situations in up and coming videos, and maybe some advice on playing suited connectors.

[throwfar]

Originally Posted by Trikkur

So now the flop comes J23r and I check. He only bets 1/2 pot and while his range is pretty tight, there are a lot of combinations of AK as compared to JJ,QQ,KK,AA. So I decide to peel 1. I don't really expect him to start bluffing this dry of a board on later streets so I think my call is pretty safe in this spot. If you want to fold, it's not really a big deal to do so. The turn comes a blank, but again, I'm ready to check/fold because I don't feel like he's going to fire 2 streets on this dry of a board with AQ/AK so I think his range would then way towards the high PPs. He checks behind and the river is another blank. Same thought process that I had on the turn applies to the river as well. I don't think he's going to bluff me too often so I'm happy to get to showdown if I can, but if he bets, I'll just fold my hand, which ends up happening.

Putting ourselves in villain's shoes, do you think a 1/2 pot bet into a 3bet pot with position is exploitable? I guess it comes down to whether you would fold 88 on that flop if he had bet closer to the pot.

Also from villains perspective what hands do you flat a 3bet with that takes this line? 4s-Ts are virtually the same, doubt you check/call with AQs, you 4bet AK and QQ+. You could have JJ but you wouldn't check three streets with top set especially when the turn was checked back. Actually after writing that statement, that wouldn't be a bad line given his range preflop, if he has those unpaired big cards, you'd be giving him all the rope in the world to bluff plus he will try to get at least 2 streets of value with QQ+ so you wouldn't have to worry about the river going chk/chk and losing value.

I guess my question is... if the player is good, do you think that check/calling the flop in a 3bet pot is +EV knowing he might barrel the river with worse knowing your most likely holding is a smaller pocket pair.

[Trikkur]

The only thing is the board is so dry, that most people don't think they can get me to fold like 88 there so they just check back. If a player all of a sudden starts barreling in this spot more than I think they actually have it, I have no problem calling with 88 here. This is where the whole "leveling" game comes into effect. Trying to figure out you opponent's action and going one step ahead.