NL100: TPTK 300bb deep

[chinz]

Sick spot on nl100 deep table - Small Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit - Small Stakes Poker Forum

Not played by me, but found this on one finnish forum.

Some questions:
A) How do you like the villain's line if he has AJ?
B) What about if he has backdoor FD that missed?

Assuming both players are winnings regulars.



Also, if you were the one with AK, what would you do on the river?

[urbansprawler]

I'd fold as well, but:

1) Terrible, 3-barreling this hand is not the way to play it.

2) Then I like it a lot.

[Silverthunder]

I guess people 3 bet pocket pairs a lot more being that deep.

The villain probably should not 3 bet AQo that deep, right? Want to pot control with AQo preflop (don't want to build a big pot with a top pair type hand, right?). Or maybe he should. Hmm..
And it's not good for us to 4 bet that AK pre?

Assuming villain played preflop properly with those pairs, we have to fold b/c no good to just hope for a split.

[chinz]

Originally Posted by urbansprawler

I'd fold as well, but:

1) Terrible, 3-barreling this hand is not the way to play it.

2) Then I like it a lot.

If it's good to bluff this with air, why isn't it good to turn AJ into a bluff here? Obviously we do have some showdown value, but still I think it's at least worth considering to turn it into a bluff. It's true that it still can win at showdown every now and then, but to be honest AJ is probably losing like 75% of the time and splitting 15% of the time here. That's why I posted this here, because he indeed did have AJ and turned it into a bluff by overbetting the river.

I'm not saying whether it's a good play or not (probably slightly -EV), but I was very surprised that anyone at NL100 would even consider turning that into a bluff here.

I don't like 3betting AJ vs. UTG in the first place, tho.

[Silverthunder]

Originally Posted by chinz

If it's good to bluff this with air, why isn't it good to turn AJ into a bluff here? Obviously we do have some showdown value, but still I think it's at least worth considering to turn it into a bluff. It's true that it still can win at showdown every now and then, but to be honest AJ is probably losing like 75% of the time and splitting 15% of the time here. That's why I posted this here, because he indeed did have AJ and turned it into a bluff by overbetting the river.

I'm not saying whether it's a good play or not (probably slightly -EV), but I was very surprised that anyone at NL100 would even consider turning that into a bluff here.

I don't like 3betting AJ vs. UTG in the first place, tho.

Really bad to 3 bet with AJ especially that deep.

when you are called on the turn, you are beat a high percentage of the time with AJ.

Not horrible to turn it into a bluff there for merge ranging purposes.

[chinz]

Originally Posted by Silverthunder

Not horrible to turn it into a bluff there for merge ranging purposes.

You probably mean range merging?

I don't give a shit about balancing my ranges blablabla at NL100 (in fact there's a lot of spots where my overbet is always a bluff against certain opponents).

If BY FAR the most likely holding for TAG UTG here (after calling 2 streets) is AQ or AK and most people (playing NL50-NL200) I have asked said they would fold it here, this bluff certainly isn't awful.

However, it doesn't really make sense to value-overbet-shove better hands than AK here, when it's somehwhat likely that AK-AQ is folding to an overbet. So, using this logic I think that some good regulars are able to make the call with AK. I do understand that. Folding ain't fun when your hand is face up.

[urbansprawler]

I was thinking that this bluff is great if he is a strong hand-reader , but AJ shouldn't 3-bet preflop first of all, and definitely shouldn't be double barreling.

[Silverthunder]

Originally Posted by urbansprawler

I was thinking that this bluff is great if he is a strong hand-reader , but AJ shouldn't 3-bet preflop first of all, and definitely shouldn't be double barreling.

agreed

Originally Posted by chinz

You probably mean range merging?

I noticed that right after I posted but was too lazy to fix it. Anyway, I am going to coin the new term

Seems like if this is a really nitty/no so much thinking tag, it should be pretty good EV (only the river play though).