100NL What is the calculation for calling with AXs pre?

[Silverthunder]

Cake Poker - Hand History


can you fellow forum members tell me what kind of money you need behind (effective stack size) in order to call with AXs hands? I would imagine that it is highly dependent on how many suited connectors are in the villain's range.

Obviously, this hand worked out well but was it a poor call pre? Pretty sure it was quite bad in this small 3 bet pot as AXs gets value from suited connectors. I did not consider this villain to have really any 3 bet bluffing range (suited connectors, etc).

Note on hand: I prob. should have min riased the river.

[csfanatikdbz]

You look like a total fish in this hand from my point of view.. And then to talk about min raising the river??

Fishy stuff:

-Min raising otb. If you don't want to pot it, raise to 3BB.

-Calling the flop. This is probably the least fishy part of the hand, but I still think you need to raise for value and protection. The board is of a somewhat wet texture, there is a club draw and possible although unlikely straight draw cards out. In addition, he has 3 queens and 3 6's in the deck to give him a better 2 pair than you, and if he doesn't get one of those cards on the turn, he's going to have 9 cards that can give him a better 2 pair on the river.

-Calling the turn. Not only are you giving a flush draw a second chance to get there without charging them and giving them bad odds, but as mentioned, he now has 9 outs to counterfeit your 2 pair on the river, which will happen about a fifth of the time. Think about this, what is he firing on that turn with? With that bet sizing, I would say a worse 2 pair, a better 2 pair (which is pretty rare, as it's very unlikely he 3bet from the blinds w/ A6, A9, or 69), TPTK type hands (which I think is the most common), or vary rarely a hand like KK-TT just trying to make sure you don't have an ace or represent a bigger one. The most likely of which I would think is a bigger ace thats trying to valuetown you. By calling here I think you missed a huge chance to build the pot. Plus, if he has 99 you let him get there, which will happen about 5% of the time a pocket pair gets to see the turn.

-Why would you min raise the river? It's weak and gives away your hand. raise 2.5x or something, or even a shove if you must. Min raising twice in the same hand too.. Shame!! You didn't take advantage of your position in this hand.

Overall, your hand held up and you won, but I disagree with the way you played preflop and every street postflop.

As far is how deep you have to be to play Ax, the deeper the better obviously, but based on the amount you had to call on his 3bet and being in position, compared to the stack sizes, I don't hate the call.

Just be glad you're not me, the board would have paired 6's, 9's, or brought a Q lol. But it wouldn't have mattered as I would have got it all in sooner with the best hand. I think if you go nuts on the flop or even turn, he's going to put you on a draw or AJ-. You missed a ton of value =[

[Silverthunder]

I think that post flop is okay on flop and turn. If we raise, we scare the entire range that we want to get value from, 1 pair only hands, that is. It may not scare away AK as much but AQ quite possibly. Even AK, though, I mean he will hope for a split pot.

I don't think that he has any flush draws in his range, though I cant say that for sure b/c I haven't played with him that much.

What stacks are okay/ medium and great for AXs for the 2 scenarios:
if villain does have a lot of suited connectors in his range
if villain does not have almost any suited connectors in his range

[AdrienD]

Originally Posted by Silverthunder

What stacks are okay/ medium and great for AXs for the 2 scenarios:
if villain does have a lot of suited connectors in his range
if villain does not have almost any suited connectors in his range

In case 1 I'd call if you have a lot of steal equity later in the hand (ie. he gives up a lot), otherwise a 4bet bluff is better.
If you're calling, Its better to have A2s-A5s cause you can flop more combo and/or backdoor draws.

In case 2 I'd say 200bb, but it also depends on both your implied odds and/or your steal equity postflop.
If you think he will fold a lot of his 3betting range to a 4bet or will call it a lot and play check/fold on flop a ton then def. 4bet.

This hand was played poorly imo. I think if you're going to raise at any point in the hand it should be the flop as this represents the most draws/bluffs and gives villain the most chance of making a mistake.
Raising turn would look very strong and reduces a lot of draws from your perceived range. It also makes it impossible for villain to rebluff light.

Wether or not to raise river is very villain and image dependent. How often do you think he 3bets A6/A9/A7 and small PPs? If you dont put those in his range you should def. raise.
I'd usually shove river as played but thats because my image is very aggro.

[Nostalgica]

Minraising can be fine, but if you do, you must do it with the intention of 4betting or calling a hand as strong has Axs with 100bbs as such, I would as played call in both cases.

Flop def raise. As played raise turn. As played shove river. I am not worried about being outdraw very much, it's just that you get way more value from pure air or draws if you small raise the flop and AQ or AK are never folding to begin with in a 3bet pot, so you are just killing your action by flatting.