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Old 07-07-2010, 02:52 PM
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Default NL100 shallow: top 2 on 3flush paired board OOP

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (5 handed)

Hero (BB) ($40)
UTG ($77.85)
MP ($119.85)
Button ($46.45)
SB ($32.40)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q, A
UTG bets $3, MP calls $3, 2 folds, Hero calls $2

Flop: ($9.50) 8, Q, 8 (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $3, MP calls $3, Hero calls $3

Turn: ($18.50) A (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, MP bets $8, Hero calls $8, 1 fold

River: ($34.50) 7 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP checks

Total pot: $34.50 | Rake: $1.70



how would you have played this hand? I was busy on other tables so overlooked my options and it seems lost some value. For now, I like leading the turn for $15 (and folding to a healthy raise), and betting blank river halfpot, any thoughts?

The villains are both losing fishes, the raiser is 26/17/7AF/24hands, another guy is 36/4/3.7AF/25hands. Small sample, so have no any specific reads. The only thing is MP check-called and then bet the river after turn was checked through in another hand (so I can expect him to bet the turn if it's checked here).
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Old 07-07-2010, 06:20 PM
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Hm, maybe raise on the flop?
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Old 07-08-2010, 04:37 AM
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The flop is dry, and I have one queen, so I think a check-raise will rather scare worse hands...
And again I forgot about stack sizes, so now I like bet-calling the turn, because I see some weaker hands in their range that might shove over my turn lead (like AxKs, AxQx, QxKs, maybe even JxJs/KxKs).

BTW, if the flop was like 68Q-twotone I think I'm leading it.

Last edited by podbelski; 07-08-2010 at 04:44 AM.
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Old 07-08-2010, 05:03 AM
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Well, there's a flushdraw out. Since it's a paired board and the bet sizing is weak they might suspect, that you are on a bluff an call you lighter /w a pp or Ahigh. Don't know about the dynamics now, but when I tried out these tables like 8month ago ppl paid you off super light.
If you think, that they fold too often in these spots you can still balance your range with bluffs and abuse that. So you can c/r this hand for value imo.
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Old 07-08-2010, 05:38 AM
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Can't say this doesn't make sense, thx. Do you mean it's still a good spot to raise if the original raiser bets 3/4 of the pot? A PSB?

BTW (just curious), do you still play regularly? What stakes mainly, if so?

Last edited by podbelski; 07-08-2010 at 05:45 AM.
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Old 07-08-2010, 11:14 AM
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I think, I raise it here almost always with these stacks. If the board was dryer (there are still gutshots and the FD...) like Q55r I'd consider playing it slow.
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Old 07-08-2010, 12:23 PM
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ok thank you
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Old 08-07-2010, 06:45 AM
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I don't like flop raise as you are over representing and there are not really that many draws. Your equity against a better hand is much worse than equity against a made hand and you also don't play many draws this way so you're not balancing or anything.

I like a small turn value raise/fold against a tighter player as you know he doesn't raise AxKs there.

Flatting flop really helps improve your range and disguise somewhat. You're not giving up on getting value necessarily by flatting. You can lead a brick turn, for instance.
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Old 08-07-2010, 12:19 PM
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@PsycheStatic: Look at the stack size... we will lose our stack vs KK+ or 8x anyways - so it doesn't matter, if we overrep or not. And I think, that we are not overrepping... it's pretty much the top of our range.
Not only is there a FD, there are also quite some gutshots. If we raise, I don't think, they will fold a Q (KQ, QJ)... and I don't think we get any more value out of 55 or so, if we call.
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Old 08-08-2010, 03:32 AM
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I don't think it's bad, but we are against a UTG range, so I don't think calling is awful. While we may get stacked by better, we do induce barrels. We can always shove over the turn, also, if they bet again and charge draws then.

I'd meant to say we have less equity against draws than better hands have against us. I think it's close either way and vs a UTG range I prefer a flat because there are fewer draws in a UTG range (fewer low-mid connectors) and fewer hands that will pay us off. Aside from KQ and QJ, which may even call one and fold turn, and we get better value by flatting and maybe repping a float/flush draw, etc even get an entire stack, or inducing a turn barrel especially on a card like As, with which we can call and call rivers potentially.
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